4 of 7
4
FSU might of just gotten Brownell fired
Posted: 17 March 2017 10:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 46 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  9625
Joined  2008-10-29

That is the most indepth post on Clemson basketball maybe ever…

All good points…I could see the school going either way on him. Apparently Wade at VCU is showing interest back towards NCSU…

 Signature 

“Looks like the upper hand is on the other foot!”
- President Tug Benson, Hot Shots! Part Deux (1993)

Profile
 
 
Posted: 17 March 2017 10:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 47 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  7285
Joined  2009-09-09

Damn A/O….When Pines is complimenting you and a post I am impressed…What it boils down to is a leap of faith.  Clemson has been a barely-over-500 program for most of existence so keeping Brownell another year isn’t going to hurt anything to try.

What is your timeline? Everyone has one.  You are obviously a big BB fan and I am curious as to your thoughts.  I don’t think Basketball should take as long to make an impact than a sport like Football.

 Signature 

When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 March 2017 02:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 48 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  12903
Joined  2008-10-29

My timeline is at -5 days.

Him and DRad had a meeting this morning.  Nothing come out of it yet, David Hood said he doesn’t expect anything to happen today.  I say hopefully Monday.  Hear lots of chatter about even other coaches hearing Will Wade from VCU as the name to replace him.  Who knows, probably just a dumb rumor being that he’s a Clemson guy.  Brownell watch continues.

Exclusive photo taken at the meeting this morning:
https://media.licdn.com/mpr/mpr/p/2/005/075/393/2f779c8.jpg

 Signature 

2()17 CHAMPS

If you’re happy with good enough, then good enough is what you’ll be. Greatness requires the expectation of excellence.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 March 2017 02:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 49 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  9625
Joined  2008-10-29

Lol…Archie Miller proves that being an alum doesn’t mean you want the job…and I am starting to think Keatts may have been a better hire anyway.

Wade seems like a good coach but VCU coaches have not fared well post VCU. I think he would be a good hire if you do fire Brownell though.

 Signature 

“Looks like the upper hand is on the other foot!”
- President Tug Benson, Hot Shots! Part Deux (1993)

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 March 2017 05:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 50 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  12903
Joined  2008-10-29

I just down for a change, shake things up.  Just make a decision and move.

 Signature 

2()17 CHAMPS

If you’re happy with good enough, then good enough is what you’ll be. Greatness requires the expectation of excellence.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 March 2017 06:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 51 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  4883
Joined  2013-01-17

The change was Clemson’s investment in facilities and BB’s best recruiting class.  You can’t expect instant success. 

He should be graded year by year.  An invite to the tourney would be nice in the next year or two.

 Signature 

2016 & 2018 National Champions

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 March 2017 06:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 52 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  12903
Joined  2008-10-29

I can expect better over a decade though, we seem to of gotten worse over a decade.  If this is his first good class then that is a problem.  You want to give him 20 years huh.

Nope, I’m done with him 100%, might as well save your breath trying to convince me otherwise.  He doesn’t deserve it, he’s failing at his job.

 Signature 

2()17 CHAMPS

If you’re happy with good enough, then good enough is what you’ll be. Greatness requires the expectation of excellence.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 09:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 53 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  4883
Joined  2013-01-17

Clem you have unrealistic expectations. 


Have you watched our football program and how it obtained success?  Dabo didn’t win a NCG 3 years in.  Despite having a good foundation to build on he developed a great marketing team and improved every facility we have. 

Brad didn’t get shit until this year and last year he didn’t get a singe home game. Would Clemson not have won the NCG without it’s investment in the sport.  Expecting a coach to come to a no history, no facilities, little support team and surpass teams with the best history, coaches, fans, and facilities is absurd.  To make it worse he JUST going facility upgrades and cashed in on it by having his first decent class an everyone is already wanting to fire him.

 Signature 

2016 & 2018 National Champions

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 10:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 54 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  7285
Joined  2009-09-09
Ancient Orange - 19 March 2017 09:21 AM

Clem you have unrealistic expectations. 


Have you watched our football program and how it obtained success?  Dabo didn’t win a NCG 3 years in.  Despite having a good foundation to build on he developed a great marketing team and improved every facility we have. 

Brad didn’t get shit until this year and last year he didn’t get a singe home game. Would Clemson not have won the NCG without it’s investment in the sport.  Expecting a coach to come to a no history, no facilities, little support team and surpass teams with the best history, coaches, fans, and facilities is absurd.  To make it worse he JUST going facility upgrades and cashed in on it by having his first decent class an everyone is already wanting to fire him.

Ok..I am going to have to stop you there with the Dabo comparison…Dabo wasn’t hired to be Clemson’s Head Coach..he took the job on the field.  He was a position coach that was never a coordinator.  He was hired as an interim to mind the store until the season ended and TDP could go hire someone.

Dabo messed around and ended up with a winning record..beast South Carolina and had a good showing in the Gator Bowl and earned the job.

He only had 12 recruits in his first class..

Dabo’s biggest claim to fame was he was considered one of the top recruiters in the country and that has never been in question.

Dabo is not considered a great X’s and O’s guy, but knows how to build a team…

He had Clemson in the ACCCG soon and ended up winning the league and making it to the first Orange Bowl in 30 years….granted, we got blasted, but he ran with that and the rest was history…

Clemson was NOT considered an elite program when Dabo took over…


Now Brownell was hired to do this job. He wasn’t and interim guy..he was picked to run the program. 

You are putting wayyyyy to much in facilities….There are schools with palaces for athletes to play in around the nation that can’t field a winning record…

It will always come down to to guy running the program….Look at Oregon football..they may have the nicest facilities on the planet and for a while it worked…but now that seems to have run it’s course.

 Signature 

When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 12:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 55 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  12903
Joined  2008-10-29

We can’t compare Brownell to Dabo remember.

If he can’t recruit without an arena to do it then he sucks at it.  How long did we know about the upgrades anyway?  He couldn’t sell that before this past year?  It has been talked about since 2013.  Point is, if he needs facilities to prop up his recruiting then he really isn’t a good recruiter.  Since you want to go ahead and compare coaches now, Dabo and Bowden both recruited without facilities.

Yes it takes a while to lay a foundation but Brownell is clearly not doing that, that should of started 5-6 years ago when he was first hired.  How you can’t understand that boggles my mind.  You don’t get 6 years and then decide, oh I better start now.  Dabo got us up to winning 10 games, perfect home records, winning bowl games, etc and CLEARLY showed improvement from year 1 to year whatever 10?  It was a visible upward trend off the foundation he set at the START of his HC career at Clemson.  He didn’t dick around for a decade before doing it.

 Signature 

2()17 CHAMPS

If you’re happy with good enough, then good enough is what you’ll be. Greatness requires the expectation of excellence.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 01:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 56 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  7285
Joined  2009-09-09

Since the Dabo comparison has been open let’s add a few more talking points:

When Dabo took over Clemson and the ACC we literally the laughing stock of college football.  FSU wasn’t that much better.  Remember ESPN’s ACC “Wheel of Destiny”?...Hell Boston College was owing the the Atlantic Division. 

The Bowden Bowl was the best gimmick going on for the ACC and both schools finally did the right think and run both Bowdens out of town and since that move both schools have won the national title with the Bowden replacements.

This was also at the peak of the SEC SEC SEC Lovefest….

Remember the term “Pulling a Clemson”?..that phrase that morphing into Clemsoning?

This is what Dabo waked into….Clemson didn’t have a lot to sell at that point.  Negative recruiters should have been able to keep Dabo from getting decent players but he made it happen.

All Dabo had was abig fan based to was extremely uneasy about him as the new guy when most people wanted a sexier name but thanks to Tommy Bowden’s buyout Dabo was the cheap way out…


Brownel didn’t have to overcome any of that.  He walked into a program that had established a nice run of NCAA appearances in arguably the best league in all of college football.

Brownel was put in a much easier situation to succeed than Dabo was…it isn’t even close.

 Signature 

When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 03:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 57 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  12903
Joined  2008-10-29

Oh and the statement of ACC being the best basketball conference is waning, just like the SEC in football.  Just look at all the flies dropping this year in the tourney.

9 teams in, only 2 left.  And it’s what only second round?  Both shades of blue as per usual.  But please, educate me how tough it is in conference now.  Use that SEC logic.  Brownell has it made on easy street and he still can’t perform.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ5yb6IPcZc

 Signature 

2()17 CHAMPS

If you’re happy with good enough, then good enough is what you’ll be. Greatness requires the expectation of excellence.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 03:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 58 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  4883
Joined  2013-01-17

Dabo has a team that historically is ranked in the top 25 in almost every measurable. We have 16 ACC championships, the biggest stadium, LOYAL fan base, huge budget, etc.  He might not have been ready to be a HC but he was given a decent amount of time considering he only started 19-15.  If you look at history and our competitions we are EXPECTED to WIN. 
http://www.winsipedia.com/clemson/vs/south-carolina?#


Brad has a team that isn’t even top 75 depending on where you look.  They are ranked so low its hard for me to find the data on it.  If you look at our history and our competition we are EXPECTED to LOSE. 
http://fansided.com/2014/10/21/75-greatest-college-basketball-programs-time-statistically-ranked/4/
#69: http://www.collegehoopedia.com/schools/top-100-programs

I’m putting too much into facilities?  So Clemson spent about $115M on 2 upgrades in the last 3 years for nothing?  Oregon has had a lot of success thanks to those facilities.  They had ONE bad season.  7 of the last 9 were 10+ wins with 2 national championship appearances.  It’s amazing how fickle sports fans can be.

 Signature 

2016 & 2018 National Champions

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 04:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 59 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  4883
Joined  2013-01-17
Clemtgrs - 19 March 2017 12:19 PM

Dabo got us up to winning 10 games, perfect home records, winning bowl games, etc and CLEARLY showed improvement from year 1 to year whatever 10?  It was a visible upward trend off the foundation he set at the START of his HC career at Clemson.  He didn’t dick around for a decade before doing it.


Dabo’s first 3 years
4-3
9-5
6-7

(/sarcasm) CLEARLY AN UPWARD TREND(/sarcasm)  Clem what happened to the last Clemson coach that had a losing season?  Oh he was fired. 

Yes ACC football did suck back then, making life much easier for Dabo.  Players were pretty good but the coaching sucked.  Funny that yall act like that was a disadvantage. 


Don’t even talk about the SEC football hype.  Their football hype was based around Bama being successful.  In case you forgot the ACC set the all time tournament wins record last year.  Half of the elite 8 was ACC where we only competed against each other to the finals.  Sure the ACC has had a bad round 2 but our best 2 teams have yet to play.

 Signature 

2016 & 2018 National Champions

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 March 2017 04:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 60 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  7285
Joined  2009-09-09

Couple of points…Clemson went 20 years before Dabo led Clemson to his first ACC win…

Second on facilities….While have a good place to participate is important you make it sound like these new facilities will serve like the pied piper making players want to magically want to play..


Oregon literally has to tie a pork chop around it’s neck to make players want to play there.  The location is horrible.  It is so remote for families wanting to see their kid play that they have to compensate….Since we are in the North West Mike Leach is keeping Wazzou competitive with significantly inferior facilities because he is Mike Leach…And there is Washington…They spent some money on facilities..nothing like other schools..Was it the Facilities or Chris Pederson that made an impact?

As for as Basketball…only a small amount of programs have these amazing facilities…most places they just go play basketball for because of the Coach or the school…

 Signature 

When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

Profile
 
 
  
4 of 7
4
 
‹‹ Oh, the irony...     Super Bowl ››